Let’s Expand the Patriot Act!

I found the following quote in the comments on Chris Prillo’s blog. “Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both. — Benjamin Franklin This bring to mind another quote from that same era. … “all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed

Their idea of securing America is a two step process:
1. Trust the goverment, ask no questions.
2. Live your life in complete, uncontrollable fear.

Good point Chris but I wonder what you be saying if ten planes had hit the USA today.

So it’s OK to play on our fears with global warming, but not with terroism?

It’s shameful!

“Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.” — Benjamin Franklin

I think that about sums it up.

That makes me so mad! The government is taking away our freedoms left and right. We have to draw the line somewhere.

But these are the people voted into office – the only way to change things is to V-O-T-E! I hope people will remember that come election time.

Benjamin Franklin got it right the first time 200 years ago: those who would exchange liberty for security desrve neither. The Patriot Act is bad enough as is: we don’t need it to be enhanced, as we already live in a proto-Fascist state.
Once our First Amendment and other constitutional rights are taken away, we won’t get them back. The powers that be in Washington know that they only way they can keep their majorities in the US House and the US Senate is to keep us off-balance and fearful. The only area where the Repubs are still ahead of the Dems is “national security”. They count on citizens who are so busy watching sports and so-called “reality” shows that they won’t figure out what’s really happening. I’m old enough to remember President Eisenhower’s farewell speech warning us about what would happen if we allowed the military-industrial complex to “govern”. That’s what we’ve got now, and we aren’t more secure because of it.

I voted against the our current “Deceider” twice. He’s a slack-jawed rat and this is like attacking a mosquito with a machine gun. We have a better chance of dying from heart disease, traffice accident or getting stabbed in a bar.

It’s great that they stopped them but they did it without starting a war in Iraq or eroding the bill of rights.

hmm, isn’t it so wierd that this plot is foiled so close to the upcoming elections. Reminds me of the Osama bin Laden tape being released close the presidential elections a few years back. Now the people are being scared again, and what do scared American’s vote, Republican! At least according to the Diebold voting machines they do!

It’s extremely difficult to figure out the best way to prevent attacks. However, compromising our fundamental principles is absolutely not the way. Any open society is, unfortunately, somewhat in danger of people exploiting the fundamental levels of trust required to maintain such a society. I find it incomprehensible, however, that people would sacrifice this in favor of fascism, in the name of security.

In looking at the answers.com definition of fascism, the following bits jump out at me:

“suppression … through terror”
“militarily belligerent”
“unquestioning obedience to its leader”
“liberal and democratic values are disparaged”
“protection of business and landowning elites”
“preservation of class systems”
“portrayed to their publics as embodiments of the strength and resolve necessary to rescue their nations…”
“rejection of reason and intelligence”
“portrayed themselves as champions of law, order, Christian morality, and the sanctity of private property”

Yikes… I just scared myself more than I was already…

I am flying to the USA from UK at the weekend with my kids for a holiday. If restrictions like no hand luggage, extra searches and a more alert security setup means our flight is a little safer….. good.

The reason Muslim kids in the UK and elsewhere have become radicalised is because a) we let them (otherwise you break race relations laws) b) the president of the USA is on our TV every night ‘preaching’ about ‘ISLAM FACISTS’, and c) Israel (supported by the US President) is bombing Lebanon back to the middle ages, like they have done already with Palestine….. (till 1948 the Zionists were the terrorists invading the Arabs’ country ). I guess the young Muslims feel desperate and hopeless. It reminds me of the school playground where the BIg (very big) Bully and his friends ‘terrorise’ (or control the territory by controlling the sweets/ (oil??) ) the other kids…… the little kids in the end always get even, maybe taking years or decades in the process. of achieving justice.

My point…. we must have a real ‘hearts and minds’ campaign to enable the moderates to triumph. …. and the USA population should start to understand what is really going on in the world. It is a pity that the US media is so trivial, and media spin doctors are so strong.

” . . . such a structure would trample directly on America’s first amendment rights.”

Which ones and how would the implementation of such a structure do so? The major difference between MI5 and the FBI seems to be that MI5 has no police powers and merely collects information.

Computers are a much greater threat to our freedom. Should they be eliminated? Babies and bathwater.

What is the word you say? “Unbelievable?” I do not think you understand the meaning of this word. A little Princess Bride humor there.

Seriously, though. This is a typical machiavellian tactic used quite frequently by Rove an associates. Now, I don’t think this happened specifically because the admin wanted something like this supposedly foiled attack to take place right after Lieberman looses his renomination bid but I wouldn’t put it past Osama and his ilk to pay attention to the politics in the U.S. so that they can keep someone who helps his cause in office, like Bush & Co. I mean, anyone who squeezes deliberately suffocates freedom and goes blundering into situation incompetantly with the military helps Osama more then any other reaction. Consider if we’d sent humanitarian aid to troubled spots around the middle east rather than bombs. Would we have the huge growth in terrorists we have since 9/11? No. Of course not. So, my take is Bush and Friends are being played like a fiddle by Osama while at the same time, this keeps them in power too, as Rove knows. Everyone benefits from this situation. Hitler knew it, Stalin knew it, every fascist government knows it. Everyone benefits except the average citizen. We just suffer under increased tyranny.

The Ben Franklin quote brings to mind another quote from that same era.

… “all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government” … — The Declaration of Independence

We must stand up, speak out, take political action and if necessary fight and die, to protect our freedoms and liberties from the attacks of religious fundamentalists both inside and outside our governments.

Yes, giving the government more power means that they are invalidating our right to free speech…….does that actually make sense to you? You are into the 9/11 conspiracy-mongering, so i guess it isnt too far of a leap for you

[...] Jake and I have been spent most of our week in Silicon Valley at the Search Engine Strategies conference – expect coverage through the show site soon. I’ve been to about four of these conferences now, though this was the first SES where I was invited to present. We stayed in the city of San Jose for the most part, attending a few casual events in the evening hours. Jake headed into SF (San Francisco) a couple of times to take care of some paperwork for his upcoming trip to China, but I really didn’t leave our hotel more than necessary. The “Google Dance” party was awesome, as I got to hang out with hundreds of industry heroes. I really appreciated the much more private Ask.com VIP dinner – sitting down with influential product managers and giving them feedback. All in all, I would consider it having been quite a productive week for me – even though I can’t wait to get home in a few hours. I haven’t spent this much time in Silicon Valley since leaving the area a few years ago to move to southern California. We’re flying out of San Jose tonight, though our flight has been delayed due to today’s events. [...]

its funny how we always speak of looking back at history to learn… yet we never seem to be able to. When Hitler started parading around in the 20’s everyone thought it was a local nutt head making waves… Islmao-faschists need to be defeated, permanently. Pussy-footing around the issue, hiding behind first ammendements, the ACLU or what have you, waving the white flag wont cut it with these guys, because it is their mission to destroy you. Last I checked these guys don’t even stop before their own children and women to get their points accross. We are living in a false sense of security.

If terrorists blew up ten planes in flight every month for the next year, the annual casualty figure would just about equal that from road accidents.

(Theoretically. In practice the airlines would go out of business before hitting equality.)

Please, please understand – if you get your information from CNN you are unknowingly bias.
I’m not sure about CNN USA, but the only credible person on CNN international is Anderson Cooper.

I agree that heightened security was and is a necessary step in fighting terrorism. The patriot act has some very good points and ways to distrubt terrorism activity. I also agree however that there has to be some sort of balance with our constitutional rights. The more rights that we give away now the harder those rights will be to get back. The need for some type of non partisian oversight group on sections such as 213, sneek and peak warrants, is overwelming. Steps need to be taken to ensure that our constitutional rights are not violated.

The patriot act is one more step towards their New World Order..using the “War on terror” to make us scared and rely on the govt. to decide whats best for our security…